Comments on Sergio's devlog: Lisp after Python after Lisp.

Thanks for all the comments!There seems to be peop...

2009-03-12T23:03:00.000-07:00

Thanks for all the comments!
There seems to be people whose pseudo-language is functional. Good to know.
I will try out Ruby in the near future, but right now I am very excited about Clojure and I'm concentrated on being able to think in lisp and to think functionally. Every day it is getting more natural.

See Python for Lisp programmers.

2009-03-12T13:04:00.000-07:00

See Python for Lisp programmers.

It's interesting to know the common mind effects t...

2009-03-12T12:19:00.000-07:00

It's interesting to know the common mind effects that code-jamming in Lisp causes in other people!
Experienced quite the same here, with Peter Seibel's PCL, SICP and now Clojure.

Nice that you read Tim Sweeney's mainstream programming languages paper! I've written an Essay inspired on it :)

http://harryreflections.blogspot.com/2008/11/reflections-roundup-series-n-1-c-winter.html

Great stuff btw!

Remove parenthesises from Lisp and you'll get (O)C...

2009-03-12T11:11:00.000-07:00

Remove parenthesises from Lisp and you'll get (O)Caml :-)

OCaml program is a pure pseudocode, i'd say.

> Every programmer has some personal pseudocode. I...

2009-03-12T08:53:00.000-07:00

> Every programmer has some personal pseudocode.

I find this statement surprising. I do not think I ever had an internal pseudocode. I just code in the language I am using. Anyway, people interested in Python and Lisp (actually Scheme) may be interested in my "Adventures of a Pythonista in Schemeland":
http://www.artima.com/weblogs/viewpost.jsp?thread=251474

My internal pseudocode has been Lisp from the begi...

2009-03-12T06:30:00.000-07:00

My internal pseudocode has been Lisp from the beginning. I just didn't realize it until I learned Lisp.

It'd be interesting to see if those that learned p...

2009-03-12T06:09:00.000-07:00

It'd be interesting to see if those that learned programming in Scheme (most common of the Lisp family for teaching) write pseudo code in Lisp instead of an imperative-like form.

I'd guess that pseudo code is like math and dreams; people tend to use their most native language (though in pseudo code people probably match paradigm and short-hand it a bit, since that's the point).

You might want to give ruby a go as a way of makin...

2009-03-12T03:25:00.000-07:00

You might want to give ruby a go as a way of making your pseudocode more functional. The syntax of ruby and python is very similar. It allows more functional constructs than python however. For example, this is valid ruby code, and works as expected:

a = if (x == 2) then
"hello"
else
"goodbye"
end

Also, blocks allow you to easily pass anonymous functions to other functions. For example:

[1,2,3].map {|x| x * 2 }

Ruby also makes some distinction between side effect free and normal code. Functions with side effects often have a ! and the end of the name. Eg

a = [10,100]
puts a.map {|x| x + 1}
# [11,101]
p a
# [10,100]
p a.map! {|x| x + 2}
# [12,102]
p a
# [12,102]

Ruby does have its problems though, mainly poor documentation, some syntax issues, a slow interpreter, and less libraries than python. If you're looking for a more functional pseudocode language though, it might be the way to go.

As a datapoint, my internal pseudocode has been Li...

2009-03-12T03:24:00.000-07:00

As a datapoint, my internal pseudocode has been Lisp since about 1989.

My pseudo-Language allways has been functionnal (s...

2009-03-12T03:11:00.000-07:00

My pseudo-Language allways has been functionnal (something between Ocaml and Haskell). My problem is translating it to C++ at my day Job. Have you ever tried to do algebraic datatypes in C++? You know, these tagged unions of sorts.

Knowing a functionnal language may have expanded my mind. Anyway, it did expand my sorrow.

There are a few others who like to compare and con...

2009-03-11T19:58:00.000-07:00

There are a few others who like to compare and contrast Lisp and Python.

;-)

I just found out that my article is on Hacker News...

2009-03-11T18:05:00.000-07:00

I just found out that my article is on Hacker News =D That's awesome, thanks to the wave of visitors. Subscribe to my blog! Expect more posts like this in the future.
pjz: Thanks for the tip!
kib: Then you feel my pain =). I'm glad you liked it!
notaddicted: I actually don't mind the lambda limit much since you can define new functions inside other functions.
nyaj: I like Haskell a lot. In the first draft I actually said that my pseudocode is a haskelly python. It may be a sign that my brain is starting to think functionally

w.r.t your pseudocode question, Haskell is fairly ...

2009-03-11T15:44:00.000-07:00

w.r.t your pseudocode question, Haskell is fairly similar to pseudocode, at least once you learn Kaskell.

I'm a lisper, btw, first and foremost.

this works in python:a = ("Hello" if x==2 else "Go...

2009-03-11T15:11:00.000-07:00

this works in python:

a = ("Hello" if x==2 else "Goodbye")

but generally your point is true. the one line limit on lambdas is a pain. one thing I like that you may not do is for a one line function definition

fn = lambda x: x*x - x + 1

Very nice post, I enjoyed reading it because I'm c...

2009-03-11T15:01:00.000-07:00

Very nice post, I enjoyed reading it because I'm currently in the same situation.

The new 'with' keyword may help out with those pil...

2009-03-11T13:25:00.000-07:00

The new 'with' keyword may help out with those piles of OpenGL API calls. if true: is also a simple semantically null way to let you indent a level.